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Thread: I believe the Hornets will deal Mashburn and Davis...

  1. #26
    come on Harv you know more then your letting on just give us the teams they they could go to. I can tell that it will be for cap room and nothing more by your post, which I think blows! We should get atleast one good starter in return for BD. or atleast a high #1 pick
    AKA St. David

  2. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Harvey Hornet
    How do you feel about cap space?
    I can get comfy with tons of cap space this off season. While I'd like a quality starter in return, given BD's attitude and injury problems that may not be likely.

  3. #28
    my thing is how good is cap space when no one wants to play here with a ****** team?.....

  4. #29
    Charter Member Contributor PELICANSFAN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Harvey Hornet
    How do you feel about cap space?
    Extremely upset. I do not trust that cap space will do anything significant for this team.

  5. #30
    Where fairies happen Contributor whoah whoah's Avatar
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    im off the game to work.... hopefully ill see some of yall there, and even more importantly, when i get back hopefully that that Harvey wanabe really Houston Hornet will have us an update....
    Quote Originally Posted by CP3
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  6. #31
    momentary lapse of re-brand NYKF Hornet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saints63213
    my thing is how good is cap space when no one wants to play here with a ****** team?.....
    We don't know that yet. Using the same logic, I could say good FAs didn't want to come here because with BD on the roster they knew their shots would be limited.

    When rebuilding a lottery team you have two choices: rebuilding through cap space or the draft. The draft rarely works, I can only think of one team that rebuilt in the draft and became a contender right away . . . the spurs. The Nugs, Bulls, Hawks, etc have all tried the draft route and it hasn't worked. It took Denver over a decade to rebuild into a contender, and now it seems their climb was short lived.

    At least with cap space you can make a run at guys who can start and play right now. Basically we would have enough money to make it worth their while to try and make this team a winner. It's also why we hired Scott and Reed, guys who may be able to get good FAs here.

    I'm not saying after 1 offseason as a lottery team we will be contenders, I really feel it will take 3 years to get back to that level in the West. But I do think we will be happy in the long run if we get rid of BD now, and take our chances in the offseason.

    I still rather get some kind of equal value in return for BD, Mash is a lost cause and cap space for him is nothing but a plus.

  7. #32
    Desk jockey Contributor Defuz's Avatar
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    Although no details are here yet, I'm seeing a pattern between Harv's hints, & what Gerry V also hinted at yesterday. Hmmmm .... cap space, huh? Guys, I think that's what we're looking at. Players may just be minor details.............

  8. #33
    Harvey - Sounds like the Bugs are more concerned with cap space than young talent. What value is cap space if players and agents don't trust Shinn? Seems more like an excuse to jettison payroll as quickly as possible. I guess they want to clear room to shop for Stro, hoping an LSU kid will get folks to buy tickets.

    Rumor making the rounds in LA today is Kupchak is making a play just for P.J. You hear anything about that?

  9. #34
    I'm wit stoopid dream34's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NYKF Hornet
    Call me a jerk, I don't really care . . . I just don't want to see BD traded to a contender or large market. I'd like to see him in a real small market, a city with no culture or entertainment choices. Hopefully the team will also be a lottery squad.
    I guess I'm a jerk too then, because I agree 1000%
    In America there is New York, San Francisco, and New Orleans everywhere else is Cleveland. - Mark Twain

  10. #35
    Charter Member Contributor PELICANSFAN's Avatar
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    Losing a player like BD for cap space is the kind of move that could doom this team for some time. When we had some cap space last season and Bristow admitted we needed to get younger and more athletic, he used the space on Rogers because he could not lure anyone else here.

  11. #36
    Drop me off in New Orleans CapitolHornet45's Avatar
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    This isn't really a good FA season either. The only good ones that come to mind are Redd, Allen, SAR, and 'Stro. Redd will end up either back in MIL or with Lebron in Cleveland, Allen is going to want a huge deal, so that would leave us with SAR and Stro as the biggest FAs we might could sign. But hey maybe Shaq will opt out of his deal with the Heat and come back home to Louisiana. After all he IS buying Saban's house lol

  12. #37
    Drop me off in New Orleans CapitolHornet45's Avatar
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    Here's a question: If BD is traded, does that mean we then go after Chris Paul in the upcoming draft? Or is Bogut still a better option?

  13. #38
    momentary lapse of re-brand NYKF Hornet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skywalker
    Harvey - Sounds like the Bugs are more concerned with cap space than young talent. What value is cap space if players and agents don't trust Shinn? Seems more like an excuse to jettison payroll as quickly as possible. I guess they want to clear room to shop for Stro, hoping an LSU kid will get folks to buy tickets.

    Rumor making the rounds in LA today is Kupchak is making a play just for P.J. You hear anything about that?
    Why does it have to be cap space vs. young talent. What young talent are we avoiding . . . BD, a late first round draft pick? Who's to say that young talent will pan out anyway? And why would players not trust Shinn?

    If anything, in New Orleans, Shinn has been overpaying players and going out of his way to do anything possible to fix our current problems (almost a complete change of staff, a new coach each year, etc). I don't buy the arguement that players will avoid the Hornets due to Shinn. His money is just as green as other owners. Right? The Shinn complaints don't fly with me. It's a different situation here, he is making more money here than he did in CLT so that is not a real excuse. Also, Shinn is the Hornets owner . . . nothing can change that, so if players are avoiding the Hornets because of Shinn, then there is really nothing we can do about it.

    I also don't buy the "jettison payroll" thing either. What haven't we done to make BD happy? He had a hand in every single offseason move, the Hornets bent over backwards to make the "star" happy. It seems we did everything possible to try and keep him, he just didn't pan out to be the max player leader we PAID for. BD wasn't pulling his weight, or earning his contract . . . a trade is only natural. Should we keep paying BD to sit out of games, hang out in LA, and then demand a trade through his agent next season as well?

    I don't want Swift at all (mainly because of his rep in the NBA), I hate the idea of building a team with local players to fill an arena. There are lots of good players who didn't go to Tulane, LSU, or UNO . . . I assume we are looking out of state to fill the roster, like other teams do. And, I feel our FO learned a lesson with Floyd. He didn't fill the arena and he was well liked by plenty of local fans. I don't see us going that route again.

    I do think the most attractive player we have on the roster right now, for contending teams, is PJ. I don't want to see him traded, but I wouldn't be surprised if right now a few contenders are making offers for him.

  14. #39
    Drop me off in New Orleans CapitolHornet45's Avatar
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    Good comments NYKF. Cap space is good, you just have to make sure you use it and use it right. Don't get caught up in a long term deal with a shaky player just to use up space and don't sit on your cap space too long just for the sake of having cap space. I'd like to see us get SOME cap space for BD, but I'd also like it if we got a solid role player or interesting prospect along with it. Oughtta be interesting to see what goes down..

  15. #40
    I'm all out of bubble gum Contributor Harvey's Avatar
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    I was just asking about cap space. I don't know what the return on Baron would be. If you were to acquire expiring contracts, what would stop you from making a trade with a team over the cap or a team wanting some space themselves? What if they had a star player making big bucks and wanted to trade him for, lets say David West just for kicks. West doesn't make a lot of money (according to NBA standards). Here's what I'm getting at. If you don't use the space to sign a player, maybe you can make a trade. The salaries on trades don't have to equal provided both teams are under the cap right? Just curious and thinking out loud here. If thats the case, cap space doesn't necessarily mean the Hornets would be using it to sign a bigtime FA or two...

  16. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Harvey Hornet
    I was just asking about cap space. I don't know what the return on Baron would be. If you were to acquire expiring contracts, what would stop you from making a trade with a team over the cap or a team wanting some space themselves? What if they had a star player making big bucks and wanted to trade him for, lets say David West just for kicks. West doesn't make a lot of money (according to NBA standards). Here's what I'm getting at. If you don't use the space to sign a player, maybe you can make a trade. The salaries on trades don't have to equal provided both teams are under the cap right? Just curious and thinking out loud here. If thats the case, cap space doesn't necessarily mean the Hornets would be using it to sign a bigtime FA or two...
    your talking a huge risk if thats what they are doing.

  17. #42
    The Franchise rainwater's Avatar
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    Whats the point of cap space? The only reason would be to sign free agents right? Who in their right mind would want to come to NO right now? The only way a trade would make sense is if they are getting draft picks or young talent in return. And you know, not many teams are going to part with young talent in the middle of the season.

  18. #43
    Banned yackman's Avatar
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    Just a thought?

    Minnesota trades: PF Eddie Griffin (8.0 ppg, 6.3 rpg, 0.8 apg in 21.3 minutes)
    SG Latrell Sprewell (12.6 ppg, 2.6 rpg, 2.3 apg in 31.1 minutes)
    Minnesota receives: SF George Lynch (4.1 ppg, 4.6 rpg, 2.3 apg in 23.7 minutes)
    PG Baron Davis (19.7 ppg, 3.9 rpg, 7.3 apg in 33.8 minutes)
    Change in team outlook: +3.2 ppg, -0.4 rpg, and +6.5 apg.

    New Orleans trades: SF George Lynch (4.1 ppg, 4.6 rpg, 2.3 apg in 23.7 minutes)
    PG Baron Davis (19.7 ppg, 3.9 rpg, 7.3 apg in 33.8 minutes)
    New Orleans receives: PF Eddie Griffin (8.0 ppg, 6.3 rpg, 0.8 apg in 21.3 minutes)
    SG Latrell Sprewell (12.6 ppg, 2.6 rpg, 2.3 apg in 31.1 minutes)
    Change in team outlook: -3.2 ppg, +0.4 rpg, and -6.5 apg.

    TRADE ACCEPTED

    Hornets get cap space and a prospect. I was talking to a guy in Minn. (who happens to work for Glen Taylor, though not the Timberwolves) who said there is a rumor that BD could be going to the Wolves.

    I don't know that this would be the trade... but it does work. Maybe they'd play Cassel in the same backcourt, or maybe they have a seperate trade to ship Cassel out of town.

  19. #44
    GO HORNETS moubre4's Avatar
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    well to be honest i dont know to much about all of the cap rules but i know you cant spend too much money, and it seems to me that its more of the selfish players that always want more more more. with any extra cap space we get from one of these deals we could sign a good player with a good attitude, i just want someone good with commitment to a franchise (perfect example would be someone like reggie miller, but reggie was also very talented, he was a win win)

  20. #45
    GO HORNETS moubre4's Avatar
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    i have no idea what i just said

  21. #46
    momentary lapse of re-brand NYKF Hornet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the337hornet
    i have no idea what i just said
    I think I know what you just said . . . you would like a good all round player that also plays a team style game with zero baggage. Reggie Miller is a great example of this (not now, back certainly back in his day): a true max contract type player, a leader on and off the court, a tireless worker in the offseason, rarely complains, and is well liked by fans and teammates.

    Those guys are out there, we just need to find one.

  22. #47
    Going away.... Contributor West Coast Hornet's Avatar
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    Maybe we can still sign Karl Malone!

    Did I just say that? No I did not just say that. Please disregard.


    Time for some football!!!

  23. #48
    GO HORNETS moubre4's Avatar
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    haha thank you for clearing that up for everyone NYKF, that is exactly what i want but who knows it may be wishful thinking

  24. #49
    Draft Pick Tarv's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NYKF Hornet
    I think I know what you just said . . . you would like a good all round player that also plays a team style game with zero baggage. Reggie Miller is a great example of this (not now, back certainly back in his day): a true max contract type player, a leader on and off the court, a tireless worker in the offseason, rarely complains, and is well liked by fans and teammates.

    Those guys are out there, we just need to find one.
    Sounds like Ray Allen to me.

  25. #50
    I'm all out of bubble gum Contributor Harvey's Avatar
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    What gives Harvey the right to post this rumor as breaking news?

    Woooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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