Shabazz

Dude has been balling out and hit a game winning 3 the other day, he point totals for his last 4 games are 24, 21, 27 and 27 while shooting 50% from the field and 49% from 3, if we could some how land this kid and sign a real center like jefferson, pekovic, cousins etc we would be insanely good in a couple years

He's a guaranteed top 3 pick. No way we are in the top 3 as long as Gordon stays healthy.

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Originally Posted by Nola Hornet

He's a guaranteed top 3 pick. No way we are in the top 3 as long as Gordon stays healthy.

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No way we finish with a bottom three record, but that is drastically different from saying that there is no way we get top 3 pick.

The year OKC got Durant, the year Bulls got Rose, and so on and so forth, they were actually solid teams with a middle position in the lottery but lucked out.

Now maybe we used up all our luck last year, but maybe Stern hooks us up one more time before he leaves in 2014.

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Originally Posted by Nola Hornet

He's a guaranteed top 3 pick. No way we are in the top 3 as long as Gordon stays healthy.

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we shall see

Impossible will won't get a Top 3 pick this year.

thats why i think we need 1 more season of tanking... could you imagine a top 3 player along with Anthony Davis? thats how the thunder became good. so finishing 30-52 would make people a lot happier than finishing 20-62, never understood that.

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Originally Posted by BLT23

thats why i think we need 1 more season of tanking... could you imagine a top 3 player along with Anthony Davis? thats how the thunder became good. so finishing 30-52 would make people a lot happier than finishing 20-62, never understood that.

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Tanking is over-used. Nobody on the team is or wil ever blatantly tank. If the hornets win great, we need that confidence and experience for the future. If we lose, ok fine, learn and get better and at the same time yes losing will help us in the draft. But we need to win games to gain confidence not just for this season but next. However, I do agree that shabazz could put us into a top 5 team in the west as early as next season, but we need more then that. Another free agent, but then what free agent wants to come to the worst team in the west statistics wise? I know that will change with Gordon back but we need to win games to make the team look appealing to big name FA's. It's really a win win situation right now, regardless of another top 5 pick we are still considered the next OKC as far as rebuilding the right way. A top 5 pick would only sweeten the pot but at the same time winning games is just as significant

In the past 10 years, teams finishing with a bottom three record got less top three picks then teams with the 4th-14th worst record but quite a significant margin.

If Shabazz is the goal, history says the odds are not in our favor regardless of how bad our record is. Give me some wins this year and lets hope to get lucky in the lottery

Let the chips, or lotto balls, fall where they may. Lightning might not get caught in the bottle again, but I think we come away from this draft with at least one of the solid SFs in this draft.

Man its my dream to have a core of Gordon/Shabazz/Anderson/Davis.

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Originally Posted by Nola Hornet

He's a guaranteed top 3 pick. No way we are in the top 3 as long as Gordon stays healthy.

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Even if the Hornets go on a nice run... it's unlikely the Hornets finish better than the 5th or 6th worst record in the league with how bad they've started, with how good the western conference is, and with how many players on this team lack experience.

Even with the 5th worst record, you're still looking at roughly a 30% chance of landing a top 3 pick.

Got a good look at him finally. He's a scorer, most def. He's that kind of athlete that isn't a high riser, super quick, or an end to end type, he's athletic enough to get to where he needs to be and can finish strong.

I'm biased towards hyper athletes. But he's a scorer, through and through.

Great scorer but if he plays SF full time, he will be one of the worst rebounding SF's in the league

Dont get me wron, I still want him, but Davis will have to become a 13-15 rpg kind of guy if Gordon, Shabazz, and Anderson all get heavy time. All would be among the worst defensive rebounding players at their position in the league.

I don't know. Anderson gets boards (avg 7.0 this season), and Shabazz has arms like Stretch Armstrong. Maybe Davis can get by being only a 11-13 reb a game guy.

Either way, we are going to get a top 5 pick. We are still that bad.

Anderson only gets 4.6 defensive rebounds a game. His overall numbers are solid because he is a great offensive rebounder. His DRB% is 17, which is poor for a PF. Smith's is also 17, and Lopez is 14.7, which is beyond awful for a Center.

Shabazz is playing SF for UCLA and he is under 10%, which is about where Austin Rivers is, and Shabazz will be against much bigger and more athletic SF's in the NBA than he is playing in college.

He will be a tremendous scorer at the next level, but he will be a poor rebounding. In fact, I think he will be the SF version of Eric Gordon. Could be an elite defender and scorer, but the rebounding will be horrible.

Again, I wouldn't pass, but this would be a terrible rebounding team

MiguelMcNamara, thanks for that heads up. I just figured looking at Ryans avg. he would be ok at rebounding (but little did I know). Who comes up with these stats, and how telling are they? Sure numbers never lie, but numbers don't paint the entire picture either (I work as a risk analyst and even I know that).

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Originally Posted by Mr. West

Man its my dream to have a core of Gordon/Shabazz/Anderson/Davis.

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Man, how fun would a Rivers/Gordon/Shabazz/Anderson/Davis core be?

Drafting him would also allow us to allot the entirety of our cap space to addressing our lack of depth at the wing positions.

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Originally Posted by UNO Gracias

MiguelMcNamara, thanks for that heads up. I just figured looking at Ryans avg. he would be ok at rebounding (but little did I know). Who comes up with these stats, and how telling are they? Sure numbers never lie, but numbers don't paint the entire picture either (I work as a risk analyst and even I know that).

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Mason Ginsberg did a fantastic job of breaking down the rates and showing what was good, what was poor, etc.

http://www.pelicansreport.com/showth...ced-Statistics

As you can see, Anderson, Gordon, Smith, and Lopez have poor rebounding rates for their position and Shabazz's rate would even be poor for a shooting guard, let alone a small forward.

Numbers dont tell the whole story, but they clearly point to all of these guys being bad rebounders and I think even the eye test tells us all that. Leaving Davis, and maybe Vasquez, as the only above average rebounders in the rotation could be a recipe for disaster.

Meanwhile, Otto Porter's rebound rate is similar to Aminu, which is the best on the team, and he also can hit the mid-range jumper and block shots. Shabazz is the better player, no doubt, but Porter would be a good consolation prize and might actually be a better fit. Chad Ford uses Pippen as the ceiling for Porter. Uh, yes please.

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

Mason Ginsberg did a fantastic job of breaking down the rates and showing what was good, what was poor, etc.

http://www.pelicansreport.com/showth...ced-Statistics

As you can see, Anderson, Gordon, Smith, and Lopez have poor rebounding rates for their position and Shabazz's rate would even be poor for a shooting guard, let alone a small forward.

Numbers dont tell the whole story, but they clearly point to all of these guys being bad rebounders and I think even the eye test tells us all that. Leaving Davis, and maybe Vasquez, as the only above average rebounders in the rotation could be a recipe for disaster.

Meanwhile, Otto Porter's rebound rate is similar to Aminu, which is the best on the team, and he also can hit the mid-range jumper and block shots. Shabazz is the better player, no doubt, but Porter would be a good consolation prize and might actually be a better fit. Chad Ford uses Pippen as the ceiling for Porter. Uh, yes please.

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I remember you said before the season began that you were not too impressed with Porter last year.

Has his play improved that much from last season?

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

Mason Ginsberg did a fantastic job of breaking down the rates and showing what was good, what was poor, etc.

http://www.pelicansreport.com/showth...ced-Statistics

As you can see, Anderson, Gordon, Smith, and Lopez have poor rebounding rates for their position and Shabazz's rate would even be poor for a shooting guard, let alone a small forward.

Numbers dont tell the whole story, but they clearly point to all of these guys being bad rebounders and I think even the eye test tells us all that. Leaving Davis, and maybe Vasquez, as the only above average rebounders in the rotation could be a recipe for disaster.

Meanwhile, Otto Porter's rebound rate is similar to Aminu, which is the best on the team, and he also can hit the mid-range jumper and block shots. Shabazz is the better player, no doubt, but Porter would be a good consolation prize and might actually be a better fit. Chad Ford uses Pippen as the ceiling for Porter. Uh, yes please.

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I remember you said before the season began that you had not been impressed with Porter's play to that point.

Has his play improved that much from last season?

To me, he's great at a lot of things, but not elite at anything. Am I wrong in drawing this conclusion?

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Originally Posted by NOH2313

I remember you said before the season began that you had not been impressed with Porter's play to that point.

Has his play improved that much from last season?

To me, he's great at a lot of things, but not elite at anything. Am I wrong in drawing this conclusion?

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It is so hard to evaluate Georgetown players on offense. For those who haven't had the pleasure (or displeasure) of watching a Georgetown game- just watch one and try to evaluate. They play at a snail's pace, play mostly Princeton offense, and play in such a way that their players cant showcase any sort of creativity. It is clear that Porter has become a much better mid-range shooter and has extended his range overall, but I have watched everyone of their games so far this year and I still dont know if he is a playmaker or if he can finish through contact.

Defensively, he does have super elite potential. A lot like a young Kirilenko. Energy for days, can rebound, block shots, get steals in bunches, defend on the ball, etc.

A potentially great fit

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

It is so hard to evaluate Georgetown players on offense. For those who haven't had the pleasure (or displeasure) of watching a Georgetown game- just watch one and try to evaluate. They play at a snail's pace, play mostly Princeton offense, and play in such a way that their players cant showcase any sort of creativity. It is clear that Porter has become a much better mid-range shooter and has extended his range overall, but I have watched everyone of their games so far this year and I still dont know if he is a playmaker or if he can finish through contact.

Defensively, he does have super elite potential. A lot like a young Kirilenko. Energy for days, can rebound, block shots, get steals in bunches, defend on the ball, etc.

A potentially great fit

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Porter certainly doesn't blow you away with his athleticism nor can he create at all off the dribble. He needs to put on more weight too. I also agree with your defensive assessment. I can see why you think he'd be a good fit given his perimeter defense and rebounding tenacity. If he can add more consistency to his shooting form and improve his range, he'd become that much better.

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

Mason Ginsberg did a fantastic job of breaking down the rates and showing what was good, what was poor, etc.

http://www.pelicansreport.com/showth...ced-Statistics

As you can see, Anderson, Gordon, Smith, and Lopez have poor rebounding rates for their position and Shabazz's rate would even be poor for a shooting guard, let alone a small forward.

Numbers dont tell the whole story, but they clearly point to all of these guys being bad rebounders and I think even the eye test tells us all that. Leaving Davis, and maybe Vasquez, as the only above average rebounders in the rotation could be a recipe for disaster.

Meanwhile, Otto Porter's rebound rate is similar to Aminu, which is the best on the team, and he also can hit the mid-range jumper and block shots. Shabazz is the better player, no doubt, but Porter would be a good consolation prize and might actually be a better fit. Chad Ford uses Pippen as the ceiling for Porter. Uh, yes please.

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porter reminds me a little bit of kawhi leonard

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

It is so hard to evaluate Georgetown players on offense. For those who haven't had the pleasure (or displeasure) of watching a Georgetown game- just watch one and try to evaluate. They play at a snail's pace, play mostly Princeton offense, and play in such a way that their players cant showcase any sort of creativity. It is clear that Porter has become a much better mid-range shooter and has extended his range overall, but I have watched everyone of their games so far this year and I still dont know if he is a playmaker or if he can finish through contact.

Defensively, he does have super elite potential. A lot like a young Kirilenko. Energy for days, can rebound, block shots, get steals in bunches, defend on the ball, etc.

A potentially great fit

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What happened to McaDoo?

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Originally Posted by CP4MVP

porter reminds me a little bit of kawhi leonard

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Some similarities, but the weakside defense and shot blocking is far different. Twice as many blocks per game for Porter in about 20% less defensive possessions per game. Leonard a better shooter at similar stage in career. 91% FT compared to 64%

By the way, going back to OP, I just watched UCLA vs. Mizz on the Pac-12 channel and Shabazz is so talented offensively. If he is not a Hornet, I hope he goes out East. I am not afraid of anybody else in this draft. But if someone like the Blazers or Jazz got lucky and landed a top pick and got Shabazz, I would be upset

We had the 4th worst record last year and still got AD. I think Shabazz is very possible.

Hypothetically if we did snag Shabazz, we'd probably have to part ways with Rivers eventually. Too many scorers can cause a problem when there's no distributor. Not gonna rule out that Rivers can't become a distributor in the future though. Even though I'm not very high on him, knowing his drive I think he can develop into one.

But yeah, a Gordon/Shabazz/Anderson/Davis core is soooooo tantalizing.

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Originally Posted by BallSoHard

What happened to McaDoo?

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he has too much aminu in him for me to like

Shabazz is the perfect fit for what we need at the 3. a little undersized, but extremely long wingspan to make up for it. could be the final young piece this team needs to complete a solid core, then look FA & trades for minor tweaks

food for thought... say we end up between 5-7... is that where GV's stock comes in to combined with our pick to move up to get a guy like Shabazz? Give Rivers an offseason of understanding the game better to move to PG full-time? Just some ideas

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Originally Posted by CP3nDX30

food for thought... say we end up between 5-7... is that where GV's stock comes in to combined with our pick to move up to get a guy like Shabazz? Give Rivers an offseason of understanding the game better to move to PG full-time? Just some ideas

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Honestly. probably not. Shabazz looks like probably the only elite prospect this year so it would almost definitely take more to move up and get him.

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Originally Posted by Nola3

Honestly. probably not. Shabazz looks like probably the only elite prospect this year so it would almost definitely take more to move up and get him.

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4 quarters isnt equal to a dollar in the NBA.