Austin Rivers with a PER below 7

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Originally Posted by Spaniard

Quick question, where do you live again? Don't you not watch all of the Hornets games?(double negative)

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I watch the Hornets and I see he has come around a little bit. I see that. But in short stretches Aminu has looked like a stud as well. I need to see a lot more of something before I will declare he has improved.

I'll tell you what. I'll watch him closely tonight against Orlando and report back if I think maybe I am overstating my case a bit. I'll watch for any signs of "life" whatsoever.

PS. I live in CA but what does that have to do with the price of tea in China?

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Originally Posted by WisconsinHornet

With good coaching and the right cast around you, this is more than enough to be a very solid 6th man in the NBA. We all know that Austin has above average intelligence and is a great teammate. He'll either learn to drive and dish, learn to finish, and/or improve his free throw percentage. It's a no brainer that he will get better. He already does the most difficult part of his job very well - he has a great first move and he gets into the paint. There's probably fewer than 150 guys on the planet who can do this routinely in NBA games.

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How do we know that he's smart and is a good teammate? Last year his team lost to Lehigh (still extremely bitter) and this year his team is the second worst in the league. Small sample size, but both remain facts. And he has to be a threat to finish to be able to drive and dish, learning to finish is a lot easier said then done and I feel like he has played enough basketball in his life that he should be able to make a contested layup by now, and improving your free throw percentage substantially requires a hell of a lot of work.

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Originally Posted by DarkHornet

I'm not quite sure what you want. As a Hornets fan, like him or not, this is the guy we drafted. He's on our team. He's not someone we're looking to acquire via trade. So what if we wouldn't want to trade for him. What do you want from Hornets fans? To say that he's bad, always going to be bad, and we should just accept that and let him ride the bench for the next 3 years?

Of course people are going to be looking for signs he might improve. That's what we do as fans. What's your end-game?

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The discussion is about whether or not Rivers is going to pan out. I'm not expecting any fan on this site to think anything. I was contributing to the discussion by asking a question. This is one of the few times that I've seen a good discussion about Rivers without anybody getting upset (perceived) about it. As far as my end game, I have none. I'm on here to express my opinion just like everyone else. I didn't know that my opinion should be the same as everyone else's

^^^ My endgame is to see that management makes the best decisions for the team as possible, drafting the best players possible, and that NO becomes an elite team comparable to something like Okc. I am going to criticize them ruthlessly until they start making the right decisions.

I really think management's decision of who to draft was clouded by their personal experiences with AR and that almost never ends well. They were just too close to make the best decision for the team and now the team (and fans) have to suffer.

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Originally Posted by sfernald

I really think management's decision of who to draft was clouded by their personal experiences with AR and that almost never ends well. They were just too close to make the best decision for the team and now the team (and fans) have to suffer.

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I tend to agree with this

Does anyone not remember that at the time of the draft Gordon was not under contract? We made the pick to cover our butts if anything happened with Gordon. Now that he is back, hopefully, mgmt has to figure out how to use both of them effectively.

Everyone looks back and says OMG how did we draft this guy and not this guy he was available. But at the time of the draft Rivers was the BPA in a lot of people/coaches/gm's minds.

Im so sick of hearing we made a bad pick. Tell me who you would have picked to go on our team that is playing so well. Man we really screwed up not getting Ross or Zeller. Rivers will prove to be a top 5 pick worthy in the next 3 years just watch.

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Originally Posted by sfernald

^^^ My endgame is to see that management makes the best decisions for the team as possible, drafting the best players possible, and that NO becomes an elite team comparable to something like Okc. I am going to criticize them ruthlessly until they start making the right decisions.

I really think management's decision of who to draft was clouded by their personal experiences with AR and that almost never ends well. They were just too close to make the best decision for the team and now the team (and fans) have to suffer.

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Whenever I read this, my question is always the same:

Who was the right person to draft?

Because I look at the guys behind Rivers and I dont see one guy who has made a mark in the league. So, if we are so quick to say it is the wrong pick, who was the right pick? Yes Rivers is playing poorly, but most of those other guys arent even playing

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

Whenever I read this, my question is always the same:

Who was the right person to draft?

Because I look at the guys behind Rivers and I dont see one guy who has made a mark in the league. So, if we are so quick to say it is the wrong pick, who was the right pick? Yes Rivers is playing poorly, but most of those other guys arent even playing

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A Lot are in the D League ^^

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Originally Posted by BallSoHard

A Lot are in the D League ^^

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Rivers should be as well. The NBA should make these kids stay in college like the NFL does. It would benefit the league, the player, and the NCAA

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Originally Posted by UptownFuz504

Rivers should be as well. The NBA should make these kids stay in college like the NFL does. It would benefit the league, the player, and the NCAA

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Ok i'll play. Let's say we put him in the D league. Who deserves his minutes more than he does on the team? I keep hearing how he should be on the bench, so let's hear it: Who on this roster should be playing instead of him?

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Originally Posted by BallSoHard

Ok i'll play. Let's say we put him in the D league. Who deserves his minutes more than he does on the team? I keep hearing how he should be on the bench, so let's hear it: Who on this roster should be playing instead of him?

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Let's be clear. You are correct in saying that no one on the roster should get his minutes but that's only because we have a bunch of guys that should be in the d-league on the roster. I have to assume the fo has future plans and that's why our roster is so bad. In a perfect world, Rivers should be in the d-league or better yet still at duke honing his skills. At one time, college was where you learned the game, not the pros. When you leave college, you should be as close to a finished product as possible. Guys like Rivers skip that process (side bar: I don't blame them) and try to learn in the NBA. So to answer you, no one but let's not forget that Rivers is the 3rd best rook on the team. He's not exactly outplaying anybody on the roster

Meh this argument is getting tired. He belongs right where he is - nobody gave him anything.

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Originally Posted by UptownFuz504

Rivers should be as well. The NBA should make these kids stay in college like the NFL does. It would benefit the league, the player, and the NCAA

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This is wrong. Staying in college only helps players who won't get significant minutes in the D-League, overseas, or the NBA. Going pro gives you access to more and better coaches, more practice time, and the ability to play against better competition for more games. Almost every lottery pick would improve more after one year in the D-League than two years in college.

The NCAA would be the only party to benefit from having players stay longer in college. The NFL is a different beast because the kids wouldn't have the bodies to survive in that league. Basketball is different. You can get pushed around with an immature body, but you won't be exposed to serious injury and can still make a significant impact as a teenager.

Your knowledge of the game's universal fundamentals only has more time to season. Staying four years in college doesn't magically make you come out with more talent. Look at Darius. He's just as foul prone as anyone else. Still has that deer in headlights look about him.

That'll go away in time, sure. But the four years hasn't really made him a better ball player.

Staying X player should've stayed is just another way of saying you don't want him on this team. You only become more of what you are. I can't think of any player that reinvented their game with more time in college. They might get more polished, but a polished piece of bronze is still bronze.

Guys like Jermaine O'Neal got drafted and simply didn't play they first four years or when they did play, they played limited minutes and were only asked to do one or two things. If Gordon were here, that is what Rivers would be doing and his stats wouldn't be so poor IMO.

I think you can learn more from ages 20-22 practicing every day in the pros, watching from the side lines, understanding how grueling the road can be, etc. I think Rivers will be better at 22 going this route than he would have been staying at school, personally. But only time will tell how this all plays out

I really like rivers shoes they're second only to the away kicks with the baby blue Velcro stripe that Vasquez rocks.

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Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

Guys like Jermaine O'Neal got drafted and simply didn't play they first four years or when they did play, they played limited minutes and were only asked to do one or two things. If Gordon were here, that is what Rivers would be doing and his stats wouldn't be so poor IMO.

I think you can learn more from ages 20-22 practicing every day in the pros, watching from the side lines, understanding how grueling the road can be, etc. I think Rivers will be better at 22 going this route than he would have been staying at school, personally. But only time will tell how this all plays out

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Minutes, practice time, and coaches to guide is what you need to develop. You go where there are minutes for you. Whether that is college, D-League, NBA, or overseas. You go where you can play and you will get better faster.

Okay so he was pretty awful during that first 6 minutes :hihi:

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Originally Posted by WisconsinHornet

Okay so he was pretty awful during that first 6 minutes :hihi:

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He didnt even take a shot

????

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Originally Posted by RaisingTheBrow

He didnt even take a shot

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Nor did he do anything else remotely useful

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Originally Posted by WisconsinHornet

Nor did he do anything else remotely useful

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Wow.

...this is getting stupid.


Er.

He did absolutely nothing in 6 mins, he sucks.

Apparently monty overreacted as much as I did?