Defensive Coach with a Great Offensive Assistant

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05-22-2015, 09:26 PM
MichaelMcNamara

Defensive Coach with a Great Offensive Assistant

I can think of several instances where a great offensive coach brought in a defensive assistant and let him do his thing. But I can't think of situations where it is the other way around. Defensive coaches are usually ultra conservative. What I am looking for is instances of defensive coaches who give the offense over to some bright assistant who pushes the pace and runs creative sets.

Can anybody think of an instance like that?
05-22-2015, 09:36 PM
GuardianAngel25

Seems like whenever the coach is defensive minded they like to slow the pace down trying to be efficient and limit the amount of opportunities a team gets which in return makes the defense look better. This is what I would hope if we got someone like Thibs but it just doesn't seem like that's what they have in mind. Do you think if we get a offensive minded coach it's possible we still Adams from the Warriors? He would be promoted here so I assume he would move. Do you have a list of good defensive assistants that would be possible for us to get?
05-22-2015, 09:52 PM
MichaelMcNamara

Nate McMillen could be interesting. Joe Prunty (Milwaukee) would be a GREAT get. Jim Boylen would be great too. Adrian Griffin if Chicago blows it all up. Stephen Silas would work

There are a lot of good guys IMO
05-22-2015, 11:12 PM
billfromfinance

How about mike brown with Cleveland when he brought in John Kuester?
05-22-2015, 11:37 PM
MichaelMcNamara

Quote:

Originally Posted by billfromfinance

How about mike brown with Cleveland when he brought in John Kuester?

That's a bit of a stretch, but it's something.
05-22-2015, 11:47 PM
billfromfinance

Quote:

Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

That's a bit of a stretch, but it's something.

haha definitely, but was all I could really think of that was anywhere close.
05-22-2015, 11:55 PM
GuardianAngel25

Yea I would love McMillen didn't even think about him. Someone like him would be a great hire if we went with a 1st time coach also. Reminds me of having Gentry just the opposite coaching skills.
05-23-2015, 12:04 AM
MichaelMcNamara

Quote:

Originally Posted by billfromfinance

haha definitely, but was all I could really think of that was anywhere close.

Yeah, that's my point. Seems much easier to find a great defensive assistant that will get to institute whatever he wants than the other way around
05-23-2015, 03:41 AM
Blattman

What about Gentry with Doc Rivers ? Also I think Pop' qualifies as a defensive minded coach that let his assistant implement new offense.
05-23-2015, 03:55 AM
Hornetsfan41

Vogel with Brian Show last two years.
Poppovic and Messina
05-23-2015, 07:55 AM
MichaelMcNamara

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blattman

What about Gentry with Doc Rivers ? Also I think Pop' qualifies as a defensive minded coach that let his assistant implement new offense.

Not the case with Pop. By the time they shifted to uptempo, he was a master of everything, and that was his decision.

Doc Rivers is not a defensive HC, at least not in the sense I looking for.

Again, I am looking for a clear defensive HC. Like Thibs or JVG, who came in and then got an assistant who they just handed the offense over to and they were creative and played with pace.
05-23-2015, 07:58 AM
MichaelMcNamara

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hornetsfan41

Vogel with Brian Show last two years.
Poppovic and Messina

Pacers were 19th and 25th in pace with Shaw there. Offense was good in 11-12, but largely due to FT rate and just great seasons by big time players, not system.

I am not saying the Pels have to play with pace and run a ton of amazing sets, but I think Dell wants to. So, if he goes for a defensive coach, that guy is going to have to try to find a way to do that for AD on offense. And it's just so much more rare that a defensive coach finds a great offensive assistant and hands over the reigns.
05-23-2015, 12:09 PM
Blattman

Quote:

Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

Not the case with Pop. By the time they shifted to uptempo, he was a master of everything, and that was his decision.

Doc Rivers is not a defensive HC, at least not in the sense I looking for.

Again, I am looking for a clear defensive HC. Like Thibs or JVG, who came in and then got an assistant who they just handed the offense over to and they were creative and played with pace.

I'm sorry but if you apply the exact same logic, the only clear offensive coaches are Don Nelson and Mike D'Antoni. And neither managed to ever have a good defense or an assistant implements one.

Regarding your comment about Pop', I'm not speaking about Messina. I think the big turnaround in terms of style of play for the spurs was in the 2010/2011 season and it coincides with the departure of some of his assistant like Borrego and I can't be certain it's all Pop'.
05-23-2015, 12:17 PM
MichaelMcNamara

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blattman

I'm sorry but if you apply the exact same logic, the only clear offensive coaches are Don Nelson and Mike D'Antoni. And neither managed to ever have a good defense or an assistant implements one.

Regarding your comment about Pop', I'm not speaking about Messina. I think the big turnaround in terms of style of play for the spurs was in the 2010/2011 season and it coincides with the departure of some of his assistant like Borrego and I can't be certain it's all Pop'.

I would consider Holberg, Atkinson, and Messina offensive coaches. And since they have no NBA Head coaching experience, I think guys will be tripping over themselves to be the Leas Assistant if you hire one of those guys. Not as much the case with Thibs or JVG because they no they won't have as much say.

Look at where the Lead Assistants who have their choice of almost any job go - to places where they will have the most say. It's why Gentry went from the Clippers to GS, for instance. He has more say with Kerr as HC than Rivers, and he gets more credit when things go well, so it fast tracks him for other jobs.

I just personally think the Pels can get a better defensive assistant coach than offensive, based on history and who is available now
05-23-2015, 12:21 PM
AD23forMVP

What's your overall feeling for the hire MM?
05-23-2015, 12:38 PM
BP225

What was Phil Jackson's core philosophy? All I ever hear is motivator, but he got his offense from Tex.
05-23-2015, 12:47 PM
MichaelMcNamara

Quote:

Originally Posted by AD23forMVP

What's your overall feeling for the hire MM?

I think the ideal for Dell would be to find an offensive minded HC who can build a great staff with a defensive lead assistant.

But I think he is open to everything. In fact, I know he has talked to far more guys than has been reported. Not think. Know.

And don't ask me for specifics people. I have gained some new high level sources in recent months and I won't burn any of them. Just take what I give you and read the clues when I put them out there. I can't do more than that. Sorry, but that is how it is.
05-23-2015, 12:48 PM
MichaelMcNamara

Quote:

Originally Posted by BP225

What was Phil Jackson's core philosophy? All I ever hear is motivator, but he got his offense from Tex.

He is probably the best example.
05-23-2015, 01:14 PM
UNO Gracias

Did I just read a Jim Boylen reference? :eek:
05-23-2015, 01:50 PM
Blattman

Quote:

Originally Posted by MichaelMcNamara

I would consider Holberg, Atkinson, and Messina offensive coaches. And since they have no NBA Head coaching experience, I think guys will be tripping over themselves to be the Leas Assistant if you hire one of those guys. Not as much the case with Thibs or JVG because they no they won't have as much say.

Look at where the Lead Assistants who have their choice of almost any job go - to places where they will have the most say. It's why Gentry went from the Clippers to GS, for instance. He has more say with Kerr as HC than Rivers, and he gets more credit when things go well, so it fast tracks him for other jobs.

I just personaly think the Pels can get a better defensive assistant coach than offensive, based on history and who is available now

I suppose, same can be said if we would hire Sean Miller or Tony Bennett. Good offensive lead assistant would probably take a chance since they have no experience. For example, how great would be a combo of Sean Miller and Kenny Atkinson ? As far as I know, Atkinson isn't the lead assistant in Atlanta, a lead assistant coach position could perfectly suits him and be a good way to be the first in line if Miller fail (like Gentry with Kerr).
05-23-2015, 02:28 PM
MichaelMcNamara

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blattman

I suppose, same can be said if we would hire Sean Miller or Tony Bennett. Good offensive lead assistant would probably take a chance since they have no experience. For example, how great would be a combo of Sean Miller and Kenny Atkinson ? As far as I know, Atkinson isn't the lead assistant in Atlanta, a lead assistant coach position could perfectly suits him and be a good way to be the first in line if Miller fail (like Gentry with Kerr).

I said this a few days ago - I have been told w/o doubt that Atkinson would only leave for a HC job.

Offensive assistants are just much harder to find IMO.
05-23-2015, 04:46 PM
Eman5805

The coach will often have final say in what the offense does anyway, even if he's a defensive specialist.

Monty wanted us to run, but nothing about his personality lends itself to a fast up and down team. Way too lax and old school.